Copper Wick Stoves

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DaddyMnM
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:26 pm
Location: Seattle

Copper Wick Stoves

Postby DaddyMnM » Wed Mar 19, 2008 12:34 am

These are some stoves I created as I followed the MiniBullDesign development of the blackfly/isofly. I was told copper wicks wouldn't work. The copper wicks are problematic in that they bring heat into the stove and with these designs heat in the stove is bad because we don't want the alcohol to vaporize. Also, the first stove I built I just drilled holes for the wicks instead of using rivet nuts as wick holders. The copper wick leaked too much air and that stove pop'ed loud when I lit it. The wick holders were to added prevent that, but I discovered that they helped to keep heat out of the stove. I passed this on to Tinny and he thanked me and used them. I must admit I wouldn't have even had rivet nuts on hand if I hadn't been copying his fuel port design on the Nion. Burn times are similar with the MBD designs. 12/08 Tinny has since changed to use silicon tubing to further insulate his wick holders and no longer uses just inverted rivet nuts.

The outer cans are water jackets and the inner cans are fuel tanks with copper desolder wick. The water jackets help cool the alcohol to prevent boiling.

Links updated 12/08
http://s272.photobucket.com/albums/jj18 ... =slideshow

Enjoy.
Last edited by DaddyMnM on Thu Dec 25, 2008 3:19 am, edited 3 times in total.

DaddyMnM
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:26 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby DaddyMnM » Wed Mar 19, 2008 12:38 am

The wick holders keep "heat" out of the stove body. Keeping heat out is a challenge in any wick stove trying to achieve maximum efficiency. It is more so with copper wicks because they are good conductors. Too much heat in the stove will cause the alcohol to boil and vaporize, making it a pressurized stove. Pressurized stoves in general burn faster, but less efficient.
Last edited by DaddyMnM on Thu Dec 25, 2008 3:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

Allen
Posts: 510
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby Allen » Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:40 am

Thanks for the post :)

It's interesting to see the developmental stages. I like the potstand too.

Cheers!

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zelph
Posts: 15822
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:53 pm

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby zelph » Wed Mar 19, 2008 12:56 pm

DaddyMnM wrote: I was told copper wicks wouldn't work. The copper wicks are problematic in that they bring heat into the stove and with these designs heat in the stove is bad because we don't want the alcohol to vaporize. Also, the first stove I built I just drilled holes for the wicks instead of using rivet nuts as wick holders. The copper wick leaked too much air and that stove pop'ed loud when I lit it. The wick holders were to added prevent that, but I discovered that they keep out of the stove. The outer cans are water jackets and the inner cans are fuel tanks with copper desolder wick.

Enjoy.


Interesting, the copper desoldering wicks are new to me. I had to google to find out more about them. It seems to have solved the problem that I experienced with fiberglass deteriorating when completely exposed to oxygen and allowed to burn/melt/ solidify and crack.

Here are some photos and a link to desoldering wick:

http://www.spirig.com/data/sheet/techni ... erWick.pdf

Image
Image
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/

DaddyMnM
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:26 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby DaddyMnM » Wed Mar 19, 2008 4:08 pm

I used the copper wicks because I work with electronics and had some on hand. I did not have fiberglass wick and couldn't find a local supply for more than a few inchs. The copper wicks definitely do not pull as hard as fiberglass or cotton so you have to keep the wick height short. Also, the copper will bring heat into the stove. I build mine like pressurized stove so that if they do start vaporizing, it's OK. It's just not as efficient. I haven't given up on them because they don't burn out.

I wonder if any metal braid will work, but I haven't picked up anything new to try. I also wonder if there is some other alternate material for wicks that hasn't been tried. For instance, are there aquarium air stones porious enough to support a burn? Next time I'm in a pet shop I'll take a gander.

About fiberglass wicks. I don't think it is the oxygen exposure that kills them. At some point, the fuel drops low enough in the can that the wick is no longer wet throughout its length and the rate of alcohol flow drops. Once it drops too low, the fuel on the wick itself no longer vaporizes and the burn, which was previously off the wick and in the vapors, moves into the wick itself. At that point, the glass fibers glow red hot and start to melt and fuse themselves together. No more glass fibers then, just one fragile glass column. It's pretty interesting to watch, but you definitely don't want it to happen by design. The recommended procedure is to blow out the flame if this happens. If your looking for a design goal, stress keeping the wick wet.

Cheers!
Last edited by DaddyMnM on Thu Dec 25, 2008 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

Allen
Posts: 510
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:50 pm

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby Allen » Wed Mar 19, 2008 4:36 pm

oops 56 has had some success with Pumice stone as a burner. I believe that is what the airstones are made from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumice

Cheers! :)

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DarenN
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Location: Surrey, B.C. Canada

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby DarenN » Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:25 pm

i was messing around with some fiberglass fireplace door gasket and found that it held some woven metal stuff along one edge. it's about 5/16" diameter and can be compressed and it will return to it's original dia.

Image

just a thought;
Daren........
"I'd rather be happy than right." Slartibartfast

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zelph
Posts: 15822
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:53 pm

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby zelph » Wed Dec 24, 2008 11:30 pm

DaddyMnM wrote:I used th e copper wicks because I work with electronics and had some on hand. I did not have fiberglass wick and couldn't find a local supply for more than a few inchs. The copper wicks definitely do not pull as hard as fiberglass or cotton so you have to keep the wick height short. Also, the copper will bring heat into the stove. I build mine like pressurized stove so that if they do start vaporizing, it's OK. It's just not as efficient. I haven't given up on them because they don't burn out.

I wonder if any metal braid will work, but I haven't picked up anything new to try. I also wonder if there is some other alternate material for wicks that hasn't been tried. For instance, are there aquarium air stones porious enough to support a burn? Next time I'm in a pet shop I'll take a gander.

About fiberglass wicks. I don't think it is the oxygen exposure that kills them. At some point, the fuel drops low enough in the can that the wick is no longer wet throughout its length and the rate of alcohol flow drops. Once it drops too low, the fuel on the wick itself no longer vapoizes and the burn, which was previously off the wick and in the vapors, moves into the wick itself. At that point, the glass fibers glow red hot and start to melt and fuse themselves together. No more glass fibers then, just one fragile glass column. It's pretty interesting to watch, but you definitely don't want it to happen by design. The recommended procedure is to blow out the flame if this happens. If your looking for a design goal, stress keeping the wick wet.

Cheers!


do you think radio shack might have some of this wick? I have a need for some, maybe alot :mrgreen:
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/

Vibe
Posts: 372
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:28 pm
Location: Little Rock, AR.

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby Vibe » Wed Dec 24, 2008 11:37 pm

zelph wrote:do you think radio shack might have some of this wick? I have a need for some, maybe alot :mrgreen:

Copper grounding braid is a bit larger and might also work. But Radio shack or Hobby lobby might have the desolder wick.

I do wish that the pictures of the stoves in the original post were still hosted though.
The opinion of 10,000 men is of no value if none of them know anything about the subject.
- Marcus Aurelius--------------------------------------------- Image

DaddyMnM
Posts: 346
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:26 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Copper Wick Stoves

Postby DaddyMnM » Thu Dec 25, 2008 12:22 am

The larger sized copper desolder wick is becoming rare. As electronics components have shrunk, so has the desolder wick. I am not familiar with what Radio Shack carries. I have a surplus store near me run by vets who seem to find the old stuff. I would think copper ground strap would work, but haven't tested it.

Copper wicks are very rugged, but do not wick as well as fiberglass. Wick must be close to the alcohol. Tinny's balckfly series is too tall for copper wick. They also conduct well and can pull heat into the stove when you may not want it to. Your stove may become pressurized when you didn't intend it to. You will have to factor that into your design.

If you do use desolder wick, try to get it without resin. Otherwise, you will need to clean the resin out before use. Fortunately denatured alcohol is a suitable solvent.

I needed space on photobucket and deleted original photos. Reposted these ...

Image

http://s272.photobucket.com/albums/jj18 ... =slideshow


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